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Post by Mr. Thomas on Nov 25, 2013 11:07:25 GMT -5
Gothic Romanticism at its best!
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Post by joeroperti on Nov 25, 2013 18:50:38 GMT -5
Joseph Roperti
Mr. Thomas
English 11
25 November
A. I Made two immediate connections to the this story to The Great Gatsby and The Raven. My connection with the great gatsby has to deal with the seeming setting of and old time and also the language. I feel that the way Mr. Hooper is potrayed he is and easy match to Gatsby. The connection I have with The Raven is when the first description of the Man in the black veil, The word "mysterious" is ultimately what triggered my thoughts of the ominous Raven
c. A quote I really liked was "The veil lay heavily on his uplifted countenance". Its old school wording is what really caught me. I really liked how a sentence like that a veil over someones face could be interpreted to Lay on someones countenance. Words like those could really make or break a persons interest in a story like so.
d. I really enjoyed the way this story was written. Old classical stories seem to catch my eye every time, because of the simple sentences being warped into such descriptive and entertaining sentences. Im glad i was able to read this piece
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Post by eointunney on Nov 25, 2013 19:19:32 GMT -5
Eoin Tunney
Mr. Thomas
English 11
25 November 2013
E. One thing that I was extremely interested about in this story was that the people in the community looked down on Mr. Hooper because he has a black veil on. They automatically look down on him because they think he has committed some awful sin. This automatically made me think that these people are hypocrites because they are looking down at the minister because they think he committed a sin. The black veil makes these people think that their own sins don’t matter because they’re not wearing a veil.
A. Just like Edgar Allen Poe, I felt this story directly relates to Hawthorne’s life. Just like Edgar Allen Poe, Hawthorne becomes depressed and lonely because his wife is now gone. Just like Poe did with the unnamed narrator, Hawthorne is using Mr. Hooper to write about his own experiences.
D. I feel that this story seemed very gothic compared to other gothic readings we have red simply because the use of the black veil. This seems extremely gothic because the color black is very depressing and is usually used at funerals. Also Hawthorne displays a gothic style of writing by writing about how the character is lonely and never wants to take off the veil.
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Post by bourdonm15 on Nov 25, 2013 20:14:41 GMT -5
Matthew Bourdon
Mr. Thomas
English 11
11/25/13
B. The story is very dark and gloomy. “But the bride’s cold fingers quivered in the tremulous hand of the bridegroom, and her deathlike paleness caused a whisper that the maiden who had been buried a few hours before was come from her grave to be married.” (Page 26) It is very strange that Mr. Hooper goes to a wedding something that is supposed to be happy and wears a black veil to the wedding. As shown in the quote, his presence caused the wedding to go from happy and joyful to sad and gloomy as well as almost deathlike. The tone throughout the story is definitely dark.
C. Why does Mr. Hooper have to constantly wear the black veil? Even after his wife asks him to take it off he won’t budge and even when she asks him why he has it on he won’t tell her. Why is that the case? “And with this gentle, but unconquerable obstinacy did he resist all her entreaties.” (Page 29) I am confused as to why he wouldn’t at least tell his own fiancée why he is doing this. What is the symbolism behind him wearing the black veil?
I. I agree with Eoin’s comment about Hawthorne and Poe’s similarities. They definitely have the same style of writing which is gothic, dark, and gloomy. It seems as if Hawthorne was influenced greatly by Poe or vice versa because they both are very similar writers. I honestly enjoy Poe’s stories more because of the twist that he provides in them.
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Post by matthewchan on Nov 25, 2013 21:06:39 GMT -5
Matthew Chan
Mr. Thomas
English 11
25 November 2013
C. What does the veil mean or symbolize? I believe the veil was like a mirror making all the townspeople aware of their own sins. The more aware the townspeople became of their own sins, the more uncomfortable they were. Being around the minister and seeing his veil troubled the townspeople deeply every day and every night. I also believe the townspeople feared the veil. There was no point in the story where the townspeople tried to attempt what the veil meant and symbolized. All the townspeople did was gossiped about the bad things the minister might have done that led to him wearing the veil. They thought that he was bad and was a sinner.
E. I find Mr. Hooper to be like the poor and “uncleaned” people during Jesus’ time. During that time of history, the poor and homeless were considered unclean, were always forgotten, were avoided, and were shown no pity or love. The only person who went up to them was Jesus. This reminds me of Mr. Hooper in The Minister’s Black Veil. Once he started wearing his veil, people thought he was crazy, a sinner, was mocked, and wasn’t approachable. The townspeople used to honor and listen to Mr. Hooper but now, these people are avoiding him like he has done something wrong.
A. I find this story to be extremely similar to the way many people treat the less fortunate today. The less fortunate beg on the street for money or food and yet some people have the right to make fun of them. At the end of the day, we are all the same and we are all humans. There is nothing different because we were created by God to help serve and better the world.
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Post by johnmarano on Nov 25, 2013 21:44:03 GMT -5
John Marano
Mr. Thomas
English 11
25 November 2013
D. I want to point out that I was really interested in a specific quote the minister said. He says “I look around me, and, lo! On every visage a black veil!” I think this quote is absolutely remarkable because Hooper is basically saying that although the townspeople aren’t physically wearing the veils, he still sees a sinner in all of them. I thought this was so important because throughout the story people were so blind to the fact that they were also wearing this veil. They didn’t realize it because it wasn’t actually covering their eyes.
C. I was a bit confused in some of the reading. I have an idea but I’m not entirely sure. Is he wearing the veil because he has done something wrong? I know he explains this to Elizabeth but he never directly reveals why. I was also confused at why he didn’t take off the veil at his deathbed. I want to say that Hooper knows we are born sinners and exit the world the same way. I want to question Hawthorne. Why did you write this piece? I didn’t see any big symbolism behind this.
I. I would like to point out that I believe I can contribute a deep thought to the whole veil thing. Hooper uses the veil to cover his face, we don’t know why, but he is obviously shameful of a sin he committed and feels he must hide himself because he doesn’t deserve to show his face. In the story, all of the townspeople look at him like he has 100 heads, like he is something out of the normal. I want to point out that the townspeople are also wrong. They haven’t come to grips that they are guilty of wrong actions to. Hooper wore this veil as it made him constantly aware of the sin he has committed. These townspeople were in shock when they saw Hooper wearing the veil because they would begin to realize that they do sin to. When Hooper was around, they would notice that they sin also. This is why they didn’t want to be in his presence.
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Post by connor on Nov 25, 2013 22:02:15 GMT -5
Connor Ryan
Mr. Thomas
English 11
11/26/13
I feel like this line can relate to a modern thought process. It says, "when their talk was interrupted by the appearance of Mr. Hooper, still covered with his black veil. It was now an appropriate emblem"(25). This line means that his black veil is now appropriate to the funeral situation they are in. In modern times their is expected dresses to certain situations just like how the black veil is appropriate for a funereal. Also this line shows that the narrator is judging Mr. Hooper for wearing it in an inappropriate situation.
I noticed a similarity between Poe's and Nathaniel Hawthorne writing because they both gothic writers. The settings are both dark and mysterious in their stories. Also another similarity is even though the writing is dark they both are very descriptive. They make it possible to paint a mental picture of what is going on and the different events in the stories.
D. A line I really enjoyed is at the end of the story when Mr. Hooper dies. It says, "while his auditors shrank form one another, in mutual affright, father Hooper fell back upon his pillow, a veiled corpse, win a faint smile lingering on the lips"(34). I really enjoyed these lines even though they were dark because father Hooper dies. I line how descriptive they are cause I can really picture Mr. Hooper being place in his coffin and how he looked when he was being placed.
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djmat
New Member
Posts: 39 
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Post by djmat on Nov 26, 2013 0:10:49 GMT -5
Dj Mat
Mr. Thomas
English 11
11/26/13
I. To answer John Marano's question he never actually fully explains why he has the veil on or why he will not take it off but he does hint at it. He tells his fiance Elizabeth that he has sworn never to take the mask off in this life. We also learn that him having the veil makes him a better minister especially when dealing with convicting sinners of their guilt. So from this we learn that the veil does have something to do with sin. But again at his deathbed there is another hint given:“I look around me, and, lo! On every visage a black veil!” With this he is hinting that everyone has a dark veil that hides their sins and secrets.
C. One thing that was a bit confusing was when Hawthorne described the movement of the veil caused by his breath. It seemed kind of useless but Hawthorne did it a few times to it had to have meant something. What does it mean and how does it effect him as a minister?
E. I would have to say i really appreciate this characters stubbornes and determination. But it think it may have went out of hand. I can understand why he did not want or could not take off the veil but it got to the point to where his fiance left him because of the effects of the veil. It kinda seemed at that point he was being a bit selfish because he kind of knowingly let this happen.
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Post by 1adams12 on Nov 26, 2013 0:13:24 GMT -5
11/26/13
D. While I was reading, several of the lines that I liked was "Mr. Hooper,a gentlemanly person, of about thirty, though still a bachelor, was dressed with due clerical neatness, as if a careful wife had starched his band, and brushed the weekly dust from his Sunday's garb. There was but one thing remarkable in his appearance. Swathed about his forehead, and hanging down over his face, so low as to be shaken by his breath, Mr. Hooper had on a black veil" (Page 22). The reason why I like these lines so much was because of the fact that these words sounded like old English to me, and the fact that they described Mr. Hooper in such an eloquently manner.
C. There were several questions that I had as a I read this narrative, but the one that still stands out to me, is the fact that the sexton needed to talk to Mr. Hooper. Even after I read all of these pages, I still don't understand why the sexton needed to talk to Mr. Hooper in the first place. Was it really necessary to talk to Mr. Hooper as soon as the sexton had a chance to? Was it really important what the sexton had to say?
E. One thing that came to my mind while I was reading this piece of literature was the fact that Arabic women have veils that cover their face, so people are not tempted to take advantage of them. Every time I heard that Mr. Hooper was wearing that veil, that is what I remembered.
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Post by rodriguezj15 on Nov 26, 2013 0:25:26 GMT -5
Joel Rodriguez Mr. Thomas English 11 November 25, 2013 Minister in the Black Veil A. When reading this I made a connection to the Crucibles. “The next day, the whole village of Milford talked of little else than Parson Hooper's black veil,” is the same reaction the people of Salem had (pg. 5). Both villages blew things way out of proportion for nothing. There were no real witches and there was no real reason for wearing the black veil. But the reaction to nothing is what makes the story. The people from both stories were so quick to judge another. They started assuming especially. The people of Salem assumed anyone a witch for acting suspiciously and the people of Milford assumed the priest murdered or sin. I. I agree with Eoin, the people are hypocrites. They don’t only not look at their own crimes and judge Hooper and patronize him but they show their faith is not real. He was“…kind and loving, though unloved, and dimly feared; a man apart from men, shunned in their health and joy, but ever summoned to their aid in mortal anguish,” (pg. 9). They only wanted him when they needed him to listen to their sin but avoided him when they were happy. C. Was there really a reason for wearing the black veil? Was the point of the story more focused on Mr. Hooper actually wearing the black veil or was it more focused on the reaction of the people? And what does Hawthorne mean in saying “For the Earth, too, had on her Black Veil (pg.5)?” |
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Post by georgebaroudos on Nov 26, 2013 0:33:35 GMT -5
George Baroudos
Mr. Thomas
English 11
25 November 2013
A – The way we present ourselves honestly stirs up discussion if we are in a prominent position. I believe that we should not judge a book by its cover. But we all have tendencies to do so. Just because Hooper is wearing a veil does not mean the level of respect should. It is very questionable but I feel like what he says should have more emphasis then how he looks.
D – “For the Earth too, had on her black veil” (26). In my opinion that is one hundred percent possible. When times are going rough I tend to exaggerate. This makes me feel like everything in my world will turn bad. In being bad I will feel sadness and anger. All of these things are dark and gloomy. That is similar to the veil that Hooper wears. It brings a negative outlook to everything he does. All of those people talking about it I feel can have both a negative and positive connotation. Those people talking can be those who will stand by you and reassuring you. The other way I see it is they can be those people who are praying on your downfall. In all honesty God is the only one who can judge me. People anticipating my failure makes me strive to do better. How we perceive it is up to us, but our world can have a black veil.
I – Having a black veil over our life can influence us. It can influence into retreat. It can influence us into self-reliance. Life is full of ups and downs and I think because they were alive in such a changing period these transcendentalists over reacted in many ways. I think the smallest bit of change made them over think. It is hard to silence these thoughts, but it is possible.
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Post by johnrice on Nov 26, 2013 2:24:21 GMT -5
John Rice
Mr. Thomas
11/26/13
English 11
***Not sure if this thing tell when a post was posted but its 2am and I am rewriting my post because the one I just wrote got deleted. so please excuse grammar and what not***
A. This is a pretty weird story to begin with. I beginning to read it right now, and I am going to do the first paragraph breaking down the title really quick. The Ministers Black Veil A parable. Alright so a minister- thats going to be someone who works with or in relation to the church obviously. He is going to have something to do with religion. I say he because its like 1800 there is no she ministers. Black veil- oooo spooky. mysterious and what not. Black usually symbolizes death or the devil right? and a veil usually symbolizes a ceremony, whether it be marriage or death. A parable- who in history gave parables? well that would be Mr. Jesus Christ. So putting all of this together we have a guy who is close with the church probably either dying or wearing a black veil (oooo spooky) and then jesus. Im going to guess before I keep reading he might be the devil but who knows, Ill keep going.
Ok so this dude Parson Hooper just walks into the town all psychedelic emo goth as a minister wearing a black veil! I immediately thought about the crucible when the people of the town started to whisper. I don t blame the people of the town for talking about him. He is a member of the church and he s crashing a town with a black veil on! Thats just screaming "Please my friends Abigail and I really want you to call me the devil!!!" You cant do that! Freaking people out because of the devil? wait hysteria because of the devil? I don't think we've read about that before!!!
Before I sign out and attempt to finish this chemistry project I wanted to point something out, and I will try to remember to ask it in class. Why doesn't Hooper just take the veil off! He says it a couple times, he hates the children running away from him, and Elizabeth wants him to take it off as well!Apparently Elizabeth is the love of his life, and he wont even take it off for her? what his deal with this veil! He mentions something about sorrow, so then if its because of sorrow, take it off! I just don't get it.
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Post by odonnelle on Nov 26, 2013 6:47:27 GMT -5
E.) Mr. Hooper is not a man I would ever consider inviting to an event (formal or informal), no less ask to preside over an event. He is Dorian Gray if Gray decided to show his cut out the face from his picture and wear it wherever he went (which would assuredly be another way Gray could have attained a vain smile upon his face). And while the lack of subtlety and Hooper’s dedication does indeed irk me, there is something to be said of intentionally wearing something as benign as a dark veil to arouse the deepest inner-reflections from those around him in a way similar to that of the narrator of The Raven (an ominous raven capable of only one sound ends up being enough to make a broken man delve even deeper into his own madness).
I.) As all the questions have to do with the black veil, it is worth starting this by noting that interpretation of the black veil (what it represents, the motives behind wearing it, etc.) are intentionally flexible both in and out of the story. In the story, it would appear that Hooper says little about the veil if not simply because that would remove the ability of those around him to relate to it. Without a fixed definition, the black veil is anything. Perhaps Hooper could be wearing the veil because he is so handsome and to simply gaze upon his face would result in the immediate affection from anyone; but without explicitly giving a reason for the veil, its purpose is found within the individual. It is dark thing which conceals the face of someone who should have a halo above their head. Why? Who the hell knows, but if the holy man is not worthy of showing his face, what does that say about me?
C.) I am unsure if this is hearkening back to the wonderful days of Puritan or if it is critiquing the Puritanical society. (Or neither.) Namely because…
Fun Fact: Nathaniel Hawthorne is the great-great-grandson of Judge John Hawthorne. The Crucible, anyone?
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Post by michaelannunziata on Nov 26, 2013 9:34:01 GMT -5
Michael Annunziata
Mr. Thomas
English 11
11,26,13
A. I can make so many different connections to this story. One connection that really caught my attention was that this story reminds me of how poor people live and what they have to deal with. For example, these poor people live on the street where everyone can see them, lets say some stupid and cruel people see him, they are most likely going to make fun of him because that could make them “cool” of satisfy them when it’s not the right thing to do. Although it might make the cruel person happy it just makes the poor person hate himself even more which can potentially lead to him comiting suicide.
E. One thing that caught my attention while reading this was the situation with the Arabic women an their veils. It is said that Arabic women wear the veils so that other men don’t take advantage of them. I disagree I think the make other men even more eager to take advantage because they don’t know anything about the girl therefore the girl doesn’t know anything about him and this means that they are most likely not going to see each other ever again.
C. one thing that I was pretty unsure about while reading this was pretty much just the veils as a whole. I don’t get why they are such a big deal in this reading and more importantly I don’t see how they make such a big deal in their everyday life.
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Post by Sgarlato on Dec 1, 2013 23:51:35 GMT -5
Stephen Sgarlato
Mr. Thomas
English 11
12/1/13
A. A main point to this story was that Hawthorne becomes extremely depressed. This relates to many people’s lives because many people in today’s world become depressed. Whether this is due to money issues or love does not matter but depression is a sever state that relates many people.
D. A part of the story that a deduced was that everyone seems to have a little gloominess in them. Everyone has their own little back story and they basically have skeletons in their closet. So what I found interesting about this was that maybe Hawthorne was trying relate this scene to people today.
C. To answer Mike Annunziata’s question I would say that the veils are used to show your true colors. If you sin you have a veil. If you are a good person like many people claim they are, then you don’t get a veil. This is what I took away from the story.
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